Come dive with us and we unravel the story of one of the greatest Sith Lords or all time, Darth Bane, with our first ever guest star, RampageReviews.
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Also don't forget we stream our live recordings on Twitch, where you can come and ask questions that'll appear on the Bonus Episode!
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Alright, just so you guys know, I am completely and utterly...
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I just... I'm on a CC's high right now. I just had so much fucking CC's pizza.
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I just... I feel good about myself.
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Hunter is not here, by the way.
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Oh, wait, how do you know he's not here?
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He said while you were deafened. He said he would be right back.
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Oh, that son of a bitch. That's why I come to his house and eat his food.
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Well, I kind of want to wait for him to be here before I go live,
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so at least he knows I'm live. I guess it doesn't really matter, huh?
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Either way.
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Yeah, well, I just want to say fuck you, Hunter.
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Welcome, guys, to The Force Unscripted. May the Force be with you.
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It's your boy, Niketa, here, back with the second episode of our second season,
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episode 10. And today is very special, very special indeed,
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because we have an amazing guest with us today.
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He goes by Rampage Reviews. And if you check out his YouTube channel,
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he does amazing reviews over the Star Wars books.
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And you guys know I'm a big fan of books.
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Winxy is also a big fan of the Star Wars novels, too.
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But Rampage excels. He's doing them in I think he's doing them in chronological order.
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Right, Rampage?
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Yep, that's right. I'm still early on in the pathway here.
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But yeah, it's and I'm meshing Legends and canon chronologically,
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like along the timeline that's defined in both Legends and canon timelines.
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And then, you know, talk about how if those things can mesh,
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if it were needed to, if they're going to pull from Legends, so that kind of thing.
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You know what? I had never thought about doing the books like that.
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I see I'm I'm about myself. I'm about 90% done with Legends.
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And I told myself, I was like, I'm not going to read a single canon book until I finish
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everything in this timeline that's never getting anything else added to it.
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And so that's my take on it. But I never thought about that,
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that like point of view of like seeing, you know, like if the timelines like mesh at all in between.
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That's pretty cool. Have you been enjoying it so far?
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Oh, yeah. I mean, like I put out a tweet not that long ago where I just said, you know,
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if you give it time, like there's so much source material that Disney could pull from from the
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Legends timeline. And they already have in some instances, like, like, I mean, whether they
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parodied something or pulled something directly from it and just very, like very few things.
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But like, if you give it enough time, they have so much source material,
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they'll probably end up pulling a lot more. And there's so much to pull.
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Like, I mean, and there's some like, like we were going to talk about Darth Bane today,
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like Darth Bane, the character is canon, but none of his backstory that's in that trilogy that came
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out a while back is considered canon. But you could you could easily make that whole trilogy
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canon. It takes place so far away from any from anything that's significant in the Skywalker
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saga anyway. And I'm a huge fan of the Legends timeline anyway, or when it used to be called
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the expanded universe. Like I just see why I just I can't I can't separate the two personally,
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just because I like all the content. And I want to see all the content come together.
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That's what I want to see. See, I am of that same train of thought,
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I would love to see it. But they've already like spat in my face on that with the sequel trilogy.
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So I don't think I can I can ever fully forgive them. I can forget. I can't forgive.
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Yeah, I totally get what you're saying. And like I was on that boat for well,
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well, like a few years after the movies came out, you know, like, and you and you,
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the initial reaction is, well, you know, everybody said seven was just a nostalgic remake of four,
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which it kind of was. And then eight was just this just went off into a completely different
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direction that people didn't see coming and then took Luke into a different persona that people
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didn't see coming either. And then nine was just another nostalgic, like they just went so heavy
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on the nostalgia that it just became kind of cheap a little bit. But then but then I also after that
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three years when I was like kind of upset about the storyline a little bit, I just said, you know,
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this is the world that we live in and this is where the storyline is. And now with like
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Mandalorian and in some of the other projects they have coming out, like there's just certain
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things they're trying to fill in the holes on the story. And as long as you can look at it as one
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cohesive storyline or try to make it cohesive, even though they
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did a terrible job of making it cohesive originally, then even like you can find a way to enjoy it,
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you know, by just trying to just kind of swallow some of the content they have coming out. And then
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you know, we always like to talk about our own headcanon too, you know, like there's stuff that
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we think might have happened, might not have happened and fill in our own holes along the way,
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you know. Oh, we'll definitely have to talk about that towards the end of this topic. I can tell
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you that for sure. And I know you had, you had mentioned it briefly about your Twitter. I just
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have to say, I absolutely love getting to see your tweets specifically when you talk about Revenge of
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the Sith. What, what are we on now? Undeck tuple or what's the... Yes. 11 times 12 is the next one.
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I'm surprised I kept up with it. Yeah, we're on the next time. Every time someone mentions that,
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I have to be like, that's the one I'm telling you. It's still the greatest thing. I was, I started
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watching right when you were like, I'm doubling down or I'm tripling down. And like I just, I've
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watched each one and it just makes me laugh every time. Yeah. I obviously like, I'm obviously
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exaggerating like quite a bit, but, but at the end of the day, it is definitely my favorite Star
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Wars movie and it's easily one of my favorite movies of all time, just because there's, there's
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so much in it and like, you know, drama, humor, suspense, you know, there's everything. And even,
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and the amount of humor that's in it, it's almost like the perfect amount of humor because it's,
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it's exactly what it should be. It's a little relief from the amount of humor that's in it.
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From some of the dramatic moments and the suspenseful moments. And then it gets into the
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really dramatic at the end and just, I don't know, like people didn't appreciate those performances
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originally when they first came out, but the more you look back on it, you're like, man, they did a
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hell of a job with that, with that performance. I thought it was great. Yeah. I mean, I still think
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no other Star Wars movie has done lightsaber choreography the way that that one did the series.
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Sure. But the movies, nah. You know, it's funny about the choreography, choreography, a lot of
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people like thought, especially like the difference between the OT and the, and the prequels,
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how they just completely ramped up the fighting and people were like, why would you do that when
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you could have made it seem more realistic? Like, like how come they're so slow in the OT and then
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they're like super, super fast in the prequels. And, and over time, kind of, like I said, with
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the sequels, they just kind of fill in the holes with the explanations. And then you kind of make
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sense of why things happen the way they did. And, you know, everybody can be like, oh, that's,
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anybody can do that. That's just, you know, just write anything in that you want to justify it.
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But that's, that's what fantasy is, man. It's fantasy. You just, you explain it and then you
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can enjoy it afterwards, you know? Yeah, I agree. I absolutely agree. All right. We've kind of gotten,
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we kind of went off the rails there for a little bit. We almost forgot what the topic of today's
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show was, but I was ready to just rant about the movies for a little bit there. It's unscripted,
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man. That's what it is. Exactly. See, someone gets it. Someone understands the true ADHD nature
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of the show. I got a script right here. I don't know what y'all are talking about. Oh, shut up,
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Exotic. I got my ADHD meds right here. All right. So let's go ahead and begin the speaking of the
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topic for today. We are talking about Darth Bane in all of his splendor and glory. On last episode,
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we kind of talked about briefly about Sith Lords because Exotic has a boner for Darth Nihilus for
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some reason, but I definitely consider Darth Bane in my top three Sith Lords of all time. I don't
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know if that's the general consensus here. What do you, how do you guys feel about Darth Bane?
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Oh, go ahead. No, no, you please guess first. Okay. Nihilus is the, is the world's swallower,
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right? Yes. Okay. I don't know a ton about his backstory only because I don't believe there are
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any novels written about him. I think we talked about that before. There's just comics and stuff
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like that. So from what I do know about him, it's like as OP as you can get with Sith Lords,
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like in my opinion. And I think he held together an empire for a really long time. So there's some
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things to compare there. Oh, wait, hold on. You might be, I think you're talking about Vishit.
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Yeah. Oh, okay. Vishit is the, is the world's lover. Okay. I guess I misspoke. Nihilus is,
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he can definitely suck the force from people. It's similar, but not exactly the same way in
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Vishit. Vishit is like a ritual that like will absorb a whole planet. I don't know if, does
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Nihilus ever ever do that, that exact same thing exotic? Cause you don't know more about Nihilus
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than I do. What like, does he ever swallow a whole, like a whole planet or does it just, is it person
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to person? He's done that. They talk about it in KOTOR too. Some planets have just been wiped clean
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by him. Okay. So he does do planets also, but the, but the emperor that you're talking about is
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Vishit. I can, I can tell you that. I don't think Nihilus was ever leader of anything really. Yeah,
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no, that's fair. Um, KOTOR was strictly the games, right? I think KOTOR had a comic series also.
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Okay. Okay. So, so the comics, I didn't play the games either. I was, I, I tried to play the games
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and I don't know that the gameplay wasn't there for me. So that's, so my knowledge on, on those
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Sith Lords of the Old Republic, unless there were novels written about them, is going to be kind of
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spotty, but back to Bane. So I wanted to compare those first because like, if you, if you've read
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the trilogy, Bane achieves a lot in a really short amount of time. And by the, by the third book,
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he's in his mid forties, I believe. And then that's when, you know, spoiler alert, he loses to
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Darzana or at least, you know, that's up in the air, right? So, um, so he, he loses and you just
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have to think, okay, well, what did he really accomplish? Because he got together a large
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network of people, much in the same manner that Sidious did, you know, to try to, to try to
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accomplish his agenda, which was just to gain as much power as he possibly can, expand an empire
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of his own and, and allow the Sith to exist as long as possible through his rule of two. That's
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what he wanted to do. So, I mean, I think if it wasn't for, you know, how the, their relationship
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was really weird too, because they were so paranoid of each other, um, Xana and, and Bane. And,
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you know, you could argue that Xana was worthy by, you know, because in, in her own right,
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with their own skillset, you know, to defeat Bane, which that was, that was an awesome fight to read.
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So yeah, I mean, like if Bane, especially if he didn't get the Orbalisks, if that never happened,
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it's possible that he could have been much stronger at that point in time and then, and then perhaps,
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uh, continued to, to rule the rule of two on the Sith and then he could have become even more
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legendary. So that, that's the weird dichotomy with him. It's like he's legendary, but he just
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had such a short amount of time to accomplish what he did. Like we're talking like 20, 25 years
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between him joining the Sith Academy and then dying. So it's, yeah, it's pretty insane.
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So I think, um, Caparsin, Caparsin, however you say his name, he, uh, he came out later and said
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that like, undeniably Xana won. There was just a question of how much of Bane was left. You weren't
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supposed to reveal that to the end. God damn it. Look, man, how can I bait him into an argument now?
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Okay, fine. No, no, no. It's already spoiled. It's already spoiled. Well, there's people-
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This is unscripted. How can you tell me there was a script when you didn't give it to me?
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There's people that argue about, uh, about what George wanted for his content as well, but then
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they still want to sit and argue, like, even though he's like defined how things are supposed to be,
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like people will come back and, and, uh, and try to come up with their own explanations for things.
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So it's like, I mean, he, if he's the author, yes. If it, I mean, so did he, did he definitively say
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that Xana is the only one existing at the end of that fight? Or did he, or did he leave it up in
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the air to- The way, the way that he explained it, because, okay, so remember how I told you,
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like, there was like an uproar, like among the Star Wars community after that book came out.
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So I think it was like, I think it was like a, like two or three weeks after the book was released,
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like he came out and made a definitive statement. He was like, no Xana won. He was like, I, but I
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wrote the ending ambiguously in case I like ever wanted to go back to like retouch it, or if anything
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was ever going to be re-added by someone else. Like that's why he wrote it the way he did.
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Initially it was supposed to be ambiguous, but because all the Star Wars fans were like,
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Xana, Bane, Xana, Bane. And he was just like, no, no, no, it was Xana. Like, I'm just going to
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clear this right now. I'm sorry I did that. I made a mistake. I forgot you guys are all fucking crazy.
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See, that's, that's, that's all I needed to hear. He left it open for his own ability to change his
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canon. Like, like of that story. So like, if he really thought he might want to change it later,
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that means that it's still open for interpretation. And I choose to believe that,
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that Bane probably, a lot more of him was left than we think it was.
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I think that there was a portion of him left. That was like the goal of him doing that. But I don't
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think ever it was going to be in question that Xana like didn't win or that like Bane was going
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to come back or something. I think it was more of like how much of Bane is going to haunt Xana,
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like, you know, till she gets kicked out of the rule of two, essentially.
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I mean, I always chalked it up to the fact like, because in the book, they even describe how like
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Bane could see through Xana's eyes, he could hear through her ears. So I assume that like,
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to some extent, she could probably feel some of what he was feeling. And if his hand was
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still twitching from like, the effects of the dark side and his aging and stuff, then I just,
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I chalked it up to that initially. Like when I remember reading the book, it was like the book
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came out in 09. I think I read it in like 11 or something because I was still in high school.
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And like, I just always chalked it up to like, if he could see and sense what she was sensing,
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then it probably worked some degree vice versa, right? So that I just chalked it up to that.
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That was my initial take. And that still is my take, honestly. I think that's why she flexes
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her left hand. Oh, yeah. You know, there's, there's something like the whole tremor thing,
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like that's such a, that was such a base instinct for him. Like, so, and so then it's like, how do
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you view that? Does that mean that so much of him was left that she now has this like base instinct
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to do that? So like, or does that mean that it's such a, it's just so ingrained that even though
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a little bit of him has is left that it just happens cause like, it just happens without even
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thinking about it. So there's just a little bit left in him that, you know, maybe thinks to do
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that. I don't know. It's, it's just such a weird way to look at it. I don't, I don't, I don't know
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how to interpret that, but I will say that given Xana's skillset, it is much more believable for
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her to win that fight, especially considering that that's her whole deal, like being able to
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psychopathically like, like terrorize people. And so that's, that's definitely believable. But yeah,
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I just, I guess I just want to believe that that pain lived longer than he, than the book suggested
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he did. Well, there's like room for that now, no, especially since like, if Disney is changing
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Bane's story from what it was in legends, Palpatine saying, I am all the Sith in episode nine. I mean,
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could it not be Bane? Yeah. Yeah. Um, wow. Yeah. Grasping at so many straws right now.
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I mean, I'm just saying like, if Disney is going to change what we know, there's, it's all up in
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the air. No, like, so that, that, that may be your reach. I am all the Sith is literally what rule of
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two is about. Like every new Sith is the, like the next one that learned everything from the previous
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one. I am all the Sith is just like, I am the culmination of all the Sith until now. Correct.
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But you could make it, I am literally all of the Sith. But you could make it that way. You could make it that way.
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I, you know, um, Sidious is no better than Bane in that respect because Bane obviously was paranoid
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of Xana, like feeling like not only like, was she not good enough to, to take the, the tradition
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forward, but then also like, he, he just didn't know like how much ambition she really had. And
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then he was like, I don't want her to find out that I might try to take someone else on. So I'm
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going to do this, but then if she finds out, then she might try to kill me early. And then if she does
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and she hasn't gained her full potential, then she's not going to be worthy. Like he just, he just
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kept having this mind, you know, can I swear? Yeah, of course. Okay. He kept having this mind
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fuck with himself, you know, about that. So yeah, Bane, so Sidious, like I said, was no better because
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he'd, you know, we had, uh, Taranus or Count Dooku, then it was the new, you know, eventually
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Anakin after that. Then, you know, then he, then it's like, Luke is supposed to take, uh, Anakin's
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place, you know, or Darth Vader's place, you know, like he, he's just, he wants to feel like that.
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He's the all powerful and someone better like really be more powerful than him if they're going
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to take it on. I don't think he ever really had any intention of giving up the master role. Like
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Sidious didn't. So, and Bane could have easily gone in that direction too, because he kind of felt like
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he wanted to stick with that tradition, but the longer that may have gone on, he would have
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continued to be like, no, it's like, I'm, I'm it. I'm all there can be, you know? And you know,
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I always, one thing that I talk about in a couple of other episodes is how much I enjoy like the
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poeticism of Star Wars to some degree. And I think that because of the precedent that Bane set and
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that XANA, uh, like eventually calls him out on is sort of like an ironic downfall for Palpatine,
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because when XANA finds out, finds out about, Oh God, what was the Sith Lord's name? It was something
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with an add, add to Don and dead. Yeah. Yeah. When, when she finds about him going after and
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deduze holocron, she's like, pissed off. She's like, what the fuck, man, we were just talking about
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this rule of two thing and now you want to be immortal all of a sudden. And then, you know,
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down a thousand years down the line Palpatine, who's literally trying to live forever by like,
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you know, like force essence transfer and stuff. Like it ends up being the end of that line of rule
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of two. Like I think that that, that is part of, of like the poeticism of Palpatine's downfall
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in my, in my opinion, at least like that's how I saw it. Because when I went back and, and I,
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I learned about like the essence transfer and then how Palpatine wanted to live forever with the
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clones and the dark empire series and stuff like that. I was like, well, I mean, I feel like that's
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just forced karma coming after you. Yeah. That last scene where you're talking about, I am all
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the Sith and then Ray is like, I am all the Jedi. Those just, I mean, I don't, I, I stand by, I don't
00:18:31
want to sit here and shit on the sequels because I do what you are doing here. We're fans. Yeah.
00:18:35
I just, I just feel like that's such a tired point of view to take anymore. Like I don't want to
00:18:43
shut on them because I just want to, I just want to continue to have everything be cohesive. And if
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that's the story, that's the story. And then I'll keep reading whatever else comes out, but, but they
00:18:52
did feel like throwaway lines. It's like, like they, it just came out like, I am all the Sith,
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I am all the Jedi. And everybody's supposed to go, you know, like, like that's crazy. But, but you
00:19:02
stand back and look at it like that. Those are like really cheesy lines, man. You know what I mean?
00:19:06
So I don't know. I just felt like they did a lot of that in the sequels where they just, they were
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trying to say things that they thought a casual might, might latch onto, but I'm not gatekeeping
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either, cause I don't want to do that. But, but like a, you know, a casual would definitely latch
00:19:21
onto that. But like the hardcore fans would be like, what? I am all the Sith. I am all the Jedi.
00:19:26
Like, like in, especially with, you know, how little training she had now, all the Jedi are going to
00:19:32
back her up. Like, I don't know. Yeah. Yeah. There's a, there's a, there's a lot, you know what? And,
00:19:38
and you know, that was the only reason. So another thing that I know we're kind of off topic, but
00:19:42
like another thing that people always shit on on the sequels is like the bad lightsaber fighting.
00:19:46
And like, I understand what they're saying, but I'm like, dude, she, what lightsaber training has
00:19:51
she had? Like if I was just given a laser sword, I'd probably swing it badly like that too. Like,
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are you joking? Yeah. You know, in retrospect, when you look at that lightsaber fighting, it,
00:20:01
I thought it was really appropriate. Like I, at first you're right. When I lost you, I'm like,
00:20:05
yeah, they are being really slow. But then you look at Kylo Ren's style and, and just his choice of
00:20:10
lightsaber, like it's supposed to mimic a broadsword, you know? So he's, he's got a really slow
00:20:15
fighting cadence, I guess you would call it. And then in, yeah, like Ray doesn't really have that
00:20:19
with his training. Like who even really, did Luke even really lightsaber trainer? It didn't seem
00:20:24
like he really did. It was Leia. Leia trained her. Oh, that's right. Yeah. Leia didn't even become a full mask. You know, like
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Leia didn't complete her training either. So. Yeah. So, so when you watch it, because of that,
00:20:34
you know, you could, you could argue in the old trilogy when they were slow, well, the, the, the
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Republic has been dead for almost 20 years at that point. You know, nobody's around, there's not a Jedi
00:20:45
order around to teach people the old ways of lightsaber training, the Form 1 through 7.
00:20:49
So Luke just had to kind of pick it up as he could and learn what he could from, from Yoda and,
00:20:54
and Obi, Obi-Wan can Obi when he could. So, so that you could, you could justify that. And I felt
00:21:00
like you could justify it in the sequels too. They just, they, there wasn't, there wasn't a lot of
00:21:04
expertise around just, just, you know, available, all available to those guys. What is your, what is
00:21:10
your source material? So Ray like knew how to fight with a staff, right? And then she goes to a sword,
00:21:15
like why didn't she just stick with a staff? That doesn't make sense. Like a double blade saber?
00:21:20
Well, she couldn't have, she, it's not like she could have made one. She had no one to teach her
00:21:23
that either. Well, how'd she make the first one? She didn't. It was, it was Anakin's. No, the spinny
00:21:28
one. The spinny one? Yeah. At the end of Rise of Skywalker. Oh, the yellow one? Yeah. Oh, well,
00:21:33
you know what? Again, plot hole. He's about to throw in like, you know what? Fuck you.
00:21:38
You know what? Fuck you. No one ever taught Luke how to make a lightsaber. Yeah. And he,
00:21:45
and Obi-Wan, Obi-Wan taught him, he communed with Obi-Wan in the, in the deserts of Tatooine between
00:21:51
episode five and six. Yeah. Cause it was like that deleted scene of him making the green lightsaber.
00:21:55
Oh yeah. I remember that scene. Yeah. Yeah. So he, he communed with, with Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan had like
00:22:00
manuals on how to do it inside of his old hut in the Dune Sea. I think it was the Dune Sea.
00:22:05
So that, that part was explained. Okay. But there's still, there's-
00:22:08
Too bad Hu Yang was stuck off somewhere else. Wait, what'd you say? Sorry, I couldn't hear you.
00:22:11
Too bad Hu Yang was off, stuck somewhere else.
00:22:16
Well, actually is he, yeah, he has to be alive during then. He has to, maybe he wasn't activated.
00:22:20
Maybe he was dormant somewhere and then Ahsoka found him. Wait, wait, no, no, but, but no,
00:22:24
he would have been alive. He would have been chilling. Yeah, but where? Yeah. Cause Mandalorian
00:22:29
and Ahsoka are five years after, right? So, so he was somewhere. I have a theory that he was dormant.
00:22:34
He was in Rebels, wasn't he? Was he? I don't remember seeing him in Rebels.
00:22:38
Yeah. I don't, I don't remember that either. No, did Ahsoka take him after order 66? I thought
00:22:43
she said that. Like, like after, like after that all went down, I thought she then said that she
00:22:48
recovered him and then activated him after that. This is why we have a robot. Brick 3PO, fact check.
00:22:53
That's what we have him for. That's what he's here for. But just going back to some of the Bane stuff.
00:22:58
So what were your, what were your thoughts on like the Orbalisks? Because there's not many times in
00:23:05
the Star Wars Legends timeline where we see creatures that are involved with the Force at
00:23:11
all. Like I really love the aspect of them feeding on dark side energies and giving like an increased
00:23:17
like strength and defense. And the only other Force, I don't know, affected creatures that we
00:23:24
find in the Legends timeline are these, these creatures called Ysilla Mirri, which I don't know
00:23:30
if you've ever, if you've run into them yet, but they pop up later in the Legends timeline, post
00:23:34
episode six. And basically they are creatures that kind of create a bubble around them. I believe
00:23:40
it's three meters where like the Force just does not exist. If you surround a Jedi with Ysilla Mirri,
00:23:47
they can't use the Force. And so the only other creatures that I know that have some influence or
00:23:52
effect on the Force or like use on the Force are those Orbalisks. So what did you think about them
00:23:57
when you read about them? Yeah. Don't forget about the Bendu. There's the Bendu. Bendu's not in
00:24:02
Legend though. No, no, no, he, no, I'm just talking about Force sensitive creatures though. Like he's
00:24:08
another one, but I'm so tempted to spoil High Republic right now, but I'm not going to do it.
00:24:16
But yeah, I don't, like when I first, when I heard them, yeah, it was just another cool, interesting,
00:24:22
you know, thing that they could create for the purpose of making Bane stronger and, and like,
00:24:26
and just some, just some more Sith lore that you can kind of get into. Like, like, and you don't
00:24:31
ever see them pop up anywhere else, obviously, because I guess they only exist within his trilogy.
00:24:35
So why would they? But, but it was, it was really interesting. And also, like, it's not the, it's
00:24:40
also not the first time we've heard of like a Sith Lord undergoing some torture, you know, in order
00:24:44
to draw upon the dark side more strongly. You got Darth Vader, he basically did it for 10, 12 years,
00:24:50
and not, not on his own doing, but still, like he was, he was surrounded by a suit. It was
00:24:55
constantly causing him pain, which presumably made him stronger with the Force when by drawing on that
00:25:00
anger and, and pain that he was suffering. So, but yeah, there was, it was an interesting thing.
00:25:05
I was also like, I couldn't remember when I read it for the second time how he got rid of him. But
00:25:11
then when I, when I read it, I was like, yeah, the whole lore of that creature was, was interesting,
00:25:15
but really gross, man. If you use that argument about, like, if you were like, oh, yeah, Sidious
00:25:23
put Darth Vader in the pain suit because he was actually Darth Bane and he just wanted Anakin to
00:25:29
suffer like he did, I would believe it. There you go. That would be a very convincing argument for
00:25:34
me. See, that's awesome. I love thinking like that, man. Like, and when you, yeah, when you think
00:25:39
about it, you could, you could kind of do that with a, with, with a lot of characters if you wanted to,
00:25:43
like, take, take that logic elsewhere. But yeah, that's, I like that. I like the sound of that.
00:25:47
Palpatine was just an evil bitch, an evil gay bitch, but an evil bitch.
00:25:52
Yeah. So then, so then you think, okay, so Palpatine created it so that way, obviously,
00:25:58
to hinder him in his own way. And, and he would been susceptible to the lightning. So it was just
00:26:02
a way to control him. But then he also knew that it was a way to make him stronger against, you know,
00:26:09
their enemies and against the remaining of the Jedi. So there was some dual purpose, some different
00:26:14
purposes there for it. Then maybe he was like, okay, so if Bane didn't exist at this time,
00:26:19
maybe Sidious knew that lore, which it's totally possible he did. Sidious was definitely a student
00:26:24
of the Sith legends. So maybe he took that lore and said, okay, well, here's a way that I can
00:26:30
make Vader stronger since he's, since he's weakened at this point, you know, that, that would be really
00:26:35
interesting. He did. He did. And it's, I don't know. I don't know. Well, so Xana would have
00:26:41
came in possession of it after that, I assume. Wait, did the dude take it? Yeah, it got stolen.
00:26:46
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. The dark Jedi. But she gave it back. The assassin lady gave it back.
00:26:52
Oh, Cognus. Cognus had it? Yeah. I thought the dark Jedi had it.
00:26:58
No, he got in dead as Holocron. Oh, yeah, he took in dead as Holocron and he was trying to learn from
00:27:05
it. And then he was going to sit and do it while Bane just like inserted himself into the Holocron
00:27:10
and stole the data. So, but yeah, he got his yeah. So, so then Bane's Holocron. Yeah, she did give it
00:27:17
back to him. Yeah, when she got him at the spaceport, she gave him the lightsaber and the
00:27:22
the Holocron back. Yep, I remember that. So after that, I don't know what happened to it, though.
00:27:27
The world we never know. Yeah. And if it if she kept it, like if Xana then came upon it and kept it,
00:27:35
and then she would have stored it away, then yeah, just through through different hands,
00:27:39
Sidious would have found a way to get it, you know, they kind of call out to people. That's
00:27:43
kind of the way you look at it. Yeah. And Sidious also had a thing of like he kind of had a monopoly
00:27:48
on all things artifacts, whether they were like Jedi or Sith. I think he was destroying most of
00:27:53
the Jedi stuff, but he was definitely he was a he was a force artifact hoarder for sure.
00:28:00
He was a he was a student of the of the dark side and of the Sith legend and and yeah, of all things
00:28:06
about the force. Like, I really believed when he when he was talking to Anakin, and he said, well,
00:28:11
if if one wants to understand the mysteries of the force, they can't they can't just accept the
00:28:15
dogmatic view of the Jedi. Like, like, I believe that he really wants to understand every single
00:28:20
thing there is to know about the force. Like, I believe he's that kind of a student of the force,
00:28:23
like not just the Sith Lords. So yeah, I would agree. I would agree. He's probably got he probably
00:28:28
went all over to search for things like that. And maybe even under Plagueis would have came upon a
00:28:34
lot of those artifacts, too. And you know, and that that holds true with one of my like beliefs
00:28:39
and tenets when it comes to force users is that like the strongest force users, in my opinion,
00:28:44
have always been those who have been versed in both the light and the dark side. The best
00:28:50
example that I can provide being like Revan. Revan was just so unholy strong in the force
00:28:56
after he is like one of the greatest Jedi Knights to have ever lived and goes off to be a great Sith
00:29:03
Lord trying to take over the galaxy that comes back to the light side facing vision. You know,
00:29:08
he gives he delivers my favorite line of the entire Star Wars Legends timeline, which is
00:29:14
I am Revan reborn and before me, you are nothing. And I'm just like, oh, yes, I've never creamed
00:29:21
my pants reading a book until then. But it was great. That's powerful. You have not read enough
00:29:25
smut. I've read no smut. And I will keep it that way. OK, I am a good Christian child. This is my
00:29:30
good Christian podcast. Please leave smut out of here. And talk about as I fuck you.
00:29:36
As we've talked about Vader being a pocket pussy and all of the like. Yeah, that's that's also an
00:29:42
interesting thing to look into, like about balance and like if someone about pocket pussies for a
00:29:48
second, I'm sorry. No, no, no, not pocket pussies. About about balance and if someone can truly be
00:29:55
so balanced to where they can control the light and the dark sides of the force, because some
00:29:59
people like, well, I think George intended the dark side to be like a cancer and then
00:30:05
balance in the force was destroying the cancer was destroying the dark side and
00:30:10
and having the only light side. And then other people say, well, no balance is having light and
00:30:15
dark coexist together. I don't. Yeah, I don't know what that answer is. I think I like the idea of
00:30:21
it being light and dark existing together. I like that definition of balance better. Obviously,
00:30:27
there's more there's more depth to it. If you do that, if you just do light side, it's like,
00:30:31
that's boring. And the Jedi are supposed to win every time. Like if that, you know,
00:30:36
I do prefer that cool kid answer. And, you know, as you as you dive into the legends timeline,
00:30:41
specifically when you get post New Jedi Order, you'll see Luke even kind of comes to the
00:30:46
realization that there has to be a balance. There has to be something, you know, like you have to
00:30:52
understand the dark to know how to avoid it and to know how to keep it, you know, in check,
00:30:57
in check, under control and that kind of thing. Because it's something that, you know, throughout
00:31:01
the New Jedi Order, they struggle with because he tries to, you know, he's like, you know, you
00:31:06
have to use these emotions, but you can't fall prey to them. And I think that that as someone,
00:31:14
you know, like as I was mentioning, Revan, Revan falling to the dark side and coming back, Luke
00:31:18
falling to the dark side and coming back, Kip Durin getting possessed by X-Arcone falling to
00:31:22
the dark side and coming back. They're all just inordinately strong force users. And I think that
00:31:27
we find out, especially in legends, I don't know if Disney delves into it at all, but having
00:31:32
experience. Anakin does it in Ahsoka. Yeah, I mean, yeah, as his place that, you know, like,
00:31:37
you know, becoming the father, you know, he does it too. So yeah, so like we see multiple times in
00:31:42
both timelines, in fact, thank you for pointing that out, because I've forgotten about that.
00:31:46
In both timelines, we're like, yeah, that that not some mastery in both is necessary. I mean,
00:31:53
you can even kind of see that in Mace Windu with his use of Vopid and, you know, knowing that it is
00:31:58
channeling his emotions and the dark side into his lightsaber form so that he doesn't have to
00:32:03
worry about himself succumbing to that. And I think that that is that is a really cool,
00:32:08
you know, thing about about the about the force. And another thing, Luke, when he goes on his
00:32:14
pilgrimage and Jason Solo, one of the twins that Han and Leia have, they also go through the kind
00:32:22
of like a pilgrimage where they they meet different force users, such as like the witches of Dathomir,
00:32:28
the Fallen Asi, you know, all the people who have different views of the force, they all call it
00:32:34
different things, whether it's like the white current or the energy source, whatever it may
00:32:39
be called. You know, they're all saying like, it's not this just black and white type of thing. It's
00:32:45
a rainbow. It's a spectrum. It's something that has to be the all facets have to be explored.
00:32:50
And I think that personally speaking, from that aspect, like, again, those who understand this
00:32:57
and can find the balance between both sides are just inordinately and innately stronger.
00:33:03
Yeah, I totally agree with that. And I hope that that's what they continue to do. Because like I
00:33:08
said, George's I think George's vision was that the dark side was supposed to be eradicated. But
00:33:12
I think Disney is kind of trying to redefine that balance. And I'm not going to spoil it. But when
00:33:18
you get into the new books, you'll see that what I'm talking about that they are trying to make sure
00:33:23
that that balance means that light and dark exists together. And you know, they could they could even
00:33:29
bring in Dawn of the Jedi into into Canada. Now that takes place so far into the past into the
00:33:34
time in the Star Wars past that it almost doesn't make sense to even go into that story because
00:33:39
it just wouldn't relate to anything. But it would still be fun to watch if they did it.
00:33:43
Oh, absolutely. I was so sad about because okay, so I was really excited for Dawn of the Jedi,
00:33:48
because the comic series was coming out like right as Disney was acquiring Star Wars in like 2014.
00:33:54
But then they canceled the coming comics that were going to further go into the story of the
00:34:00
Dawn of the Jedi. And I was so sad because I was so excited about man when I heard about Force
00:34:05
imbued swords, I was like, for real, it doesn't that doesn't surprise me. They probably wanted
00:34:09
to control that narrative for that story. And that's and that's also why they labeled everything
00:34:15
legends, you know, so they could have control over, you know, what content they wanted to bring in
00:34:18
what content they wanted to create. And just what was the most moneymaker for them, they could
00:34:23
continue to do this for decades, even over a century, I'm sure if they just if they they have
00:34:28
so much material there. And there's so many different ways you can go that George is,
00:34:32
I don't think he gets enough credit for how much of a genius it is. And I think $4 billion, I think
00:34:36
he I think he got he got shafted with that much. He that thing's worth like 2030 billion dollars,
00:34:43
you know, at least. So because Disney is making all that money back right now. So
00:34:50
one of the like pro upcoming projects, I don't know if it was canceled or not. But I thought
00:34:54
one of them was going to dive into the origins of the Jedi. Like like a new series. Yeah, or a movie,
00:35:00
one of the two. Yeah, I can't think of it. And nothing comes to mind right now. Nothing comes
00:35:05
to mind for me either. I know, like the most recent one that's probably going to come out is
00:35:09
acolyte that delves into like anything backstory wise on for scissors. Acolyte supposed to be 100
00:35:15
years bby, I think, or 100 years before the prequels, one of the two, they might they might
00:35:21
talk about it in that series. I am excited for that series, because I'm excited to see where it
00:35:25
ties into the High Republic. I'm just excited for it. Because there's gonna be a wookie Jedi.
00:35:28
Yeah, there you go. Yeah, yeah, yeah. James Mangold's Dawn of the Jedi movie. Oh,
00:35:34
what years that so it's after supposedly a Soka season two and whatever Taika had or has in
00:35:42
development. I'm so excited about Taika. What's he getting to do anything Star Wars? He's one of
00:35:46
my favorite directors of all time. What did you think about love and thunder? It's my favorite
00:35:51
Thor movie. Yeah. Okay. And when she I prefer Ragnarok. Okay. Oh, actually, you know what,
00:36:00
I think that's what I'm thinking of is Ragnarok. Because Ragnarok is the more funny one, right?
00:36:05
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's the one that has that Ragnarok is the one with with chubby Thor. No,
00:36:10
that's that's the last movie. I'm getting I'm getting my shit kind of blended together. No,
00:36:14
no, no. Ragnarok is the one where fighting his sister. Yeah, it's the opening scene where he's
00:36:20
like in the chain and he's like spinning around. Yes. Okay. I like that one. Oh, yeah. So that's
00:36:25
right. Yeah. So I well I because I thought love and thunder was the less serious movie that like
00:36:31
it got less serious when love and thunder came out. And not that like not that that stuff has
00:36:35
to be serious. But it does kind of like, I don't know, like for me, it engages me more because
00:36:40
then there's like more on the line when it's more serious. And that's and then I'm just more like
00:36:44
thrilled to watch it. Or then when it gets less serious, I'm like, who cares what happens, you
00:36:48
know, and then it's just it's funny. And, and that's good. It's not like I'm not entertained,
00:36:52
but from just from a content and storyline aspect, I like it when it's more serious. So I bring that
00:36:58
up because of his future project with Star Wars. I in not that Disney didn't really kind of do the
00:37:06
same thing at certain points with the sequel trilogy, but I, I worry that the suspenseful
00:37:12
theme that we see in some of the TV shows and the movies will just, I don't know, will turn will
00:37:18
like turn a different direction and with his movie, and like it's it's it's just something else. It's
00:37:23
fine. Like it, I'll probably still enjoy it. But if it was something like that, but I don't know,
00:37:27
I enjoy it being more serious because then it's there's like I said, there's more on the line.
00:37:31
And it's like, I get I get drawn in way, way harder. You know what, I would be absolutely
00:37:36
okay with like a comedic relief esque Star Wars movie. I'm not gonna lie, because I like I said
00:37:42
so I fell in love with the Lego Star Wars like Skywalker series. And I love the like comedic
00:37:48
twist that it puts on Star Wars because I had never experienced comedy plus Star Wars really,
00:37:53
the prequels kind of tried to do it with Jar Jar. It wasn't really working for me as a kid. It still
00:37:57
doesn't really work for me now. I just think he's kind of goofy. But like, I would love to see
00:38:00
something truly like Star Wars comedic. I feel like that's never I never saw Lego Star Wars
00:38:06
either. So I didn't watch that. But uh, is it good? Oh, well, well, isn't there I thought there was a
00:38:12
there was a Lego Star Wars movie though, wasn't there? Like an animated like an animated movie,
00:38:16
I thought. Oh, there's not a there's not an animated movie. But there's a series.
00:38:20
I'm just thinking of the Lego movie. Nevermind my bad. No, there is a Lego Star Wars series,
00:38:25
though, like animated series. Okay, I wouldn't say it's a series. Okay. Well, it's short. Yeah,
00:38:31
I never watched that either. What? I'm not short. Okay, you're tall. Thank you. But I'm also shut
00:38:39
up. Fuck you. We have got so off track. But I have enjoyed this conversation. No, no, keep going,
00:38:45
please. No, I yeah, no, you continue. I can't remember what I was saying.
00:38:51
Barely even like dived into Bane at all. Hey, he's he maybe is alive. And we were like,
00:38:58
orbalist. And then we were like, all right, tangent. Hey, look, it's it's the force unscripted for a
00:39:05
reason you already said. So I was about to say what this podcast is really good for going on
00:39:08
tangents. We got to keep it exciting somehow. And we got to let our ADHD minds run crazy. So back
00:39:16
to Bane truly, though, have you seen anything in canon about Bane so far in your book reading? Or
00:39:23
have they have they released anything about Bane in the canon? There was one Clone Wars episode
00:39:29
where Bane existed. And that was just when Yoda communed with his spirit. I can't remember what
00:39:34
that conversation was. I know that I know that Yoda definitively said you're the creator of the
00:39:39
rule to or he said he's a Bane creator of the rule to that's how he addressed him. So his his
00:39:44
character and the fact that he's the creator of the rule to are both canon. That's it. That's it.
00:39:50
That's the only thing I think that's the only thing that exists. Unless you know, you guys remember
00:39:54
anything else. But he looked whack in Clone Wars, too. Yeah, it was not at all what I
00:39:59
imagined him like. Oh, yeah. The weird helmet thing. Yeah. Like Shredder. He looked like Shredder to me.
00:40:07
Shredder from from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. Oh, yeah. I just looked up his picture and I
00:40:12
immediately knew exactly. I was like Shredder Shredder. Shredder. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I
00:40:19
because I imagined him being like, well, this is kind of what his picture looks like to when you
00:40:22
look at pictures of online. Like, I thought if there was going to be a Bane movie or a series
00:40:27
that was the guy's name that played Thor or not Thor Thanos, Josh Brolin. Brolin. Yes. Yeah. I
00:40:34
thought he would be a great actor to be Bane if he was I mean, he's getting older. But if he was
00:40:38
younger, he would have been I thought I just like the way he talks. And I think that's how I imagine
00:40:43
Bane talking like just very matter of factly, no nonsense driven with an agenda. Like that's
00:40:50
that just sounded like Bane to me. So I thought he'd be a great actor for Bane. You know, I think he
00:40:55
would actually be like better portrayed than Bane. Candris Ordo. Who is that? Candris Ordo was did
00:41:05
you have you read the Revan book yet? It's been a little while, but yeah. Yeah. Candris Ordo was the
00:41:10
basically the one that killed his wife to like help Revan find the mask of his people.
00:41:14
Oh, I just posted a picture in the chat comparing the two. Oh, wow. Jesus. Oh, wow. Yeah. Yeah. See,
00:41:21
I think he would he would do better as a kid because I can't you get to play with Candris Ordo
00:41:26
in the in the in the KOTOR game. And I was just thinking about Josh Brolin. I was like, he would
00:41:31
make a really good candor. Okay, I can see that. Yeah. I want you to know I searched Josh Brolin,
00:41:37
Darth Bane and I got Josh Brolin, Candris Ordo. Okay, so somebody heard this discussion and
00:41:45
decided to prep my. Yeah. Yeah, here you go. Yeah. You make a pretty good Bane too. I can see it if
00:41:54
you shaved his head. I can see it right now. I just like put the put like the eye makeup on
00:41:58
and shave his head. Yeah. So like if I when I was reading the Bane books and I kept like like I would
00:42:05
like read about Bane and then I would like close the book and look at the cover. And I don't know,
00:42:10
my mental image reading about Bane never matched what was on the cover. Like I could never see that.
00:42:16
Okay. He doesn't look like that in my head at all. Yeah, like me either. Like the cover,
00:42:21
like the artist who did the cover. I'm like, I'm not saying it's bad art. It just wasn't what I
00:42:25
was seeing in my head. The rule of two art was way different than the first and third book. Like the
00:42:30
first and third book were very consistent. And the rule of two, he just like like, like, I don't know
00:42:34
what happened there. But he just like turned into something else. Rule of two was done with Photoshop,
00:42:40
but that's closer to my head cannon than the others. Oh, really? Okay. I like what I had to
00:42:45
like go with the first book because when I saw his picture in the first book, that's just what stuck
00:42:49
in my head. And then that's, that's all I could envision as after that. So then when I when I read
00:42:54
rule two, I thought it was really weird. And then I read path of destruction, or not path of destruction,
00:42:59
dynasty of evil, then that looked more like what I thought, envision a mass. So I kind of attributed
00:43:04
the the like horrible, you know, disfigurement in the second cover to the orbalists. Yeah,
00:43:11
well, and you can I guess you can kind of see them. I'd have to pull the pull the book cover
00:43:15
just to see it. But I let me see if I can find a I don't know on the second cover, he reminds me
00:43:19
of Nosferatu. That's that's the only thing I could think of say it again reminds you of what
00:43:23
Nosferatu the vampire, like from the 30s. Oh, man. That's how we're gonna go. I'll I posted a gift
00:43:30
Nosferatu from the spudge blob episode. There was there was make fun of him. But he reminds me of
00:43:37
Okay, yeah, I'm not familiar. But I think I will. Yeah, I can I can imagine the old Dracula and
00:43:44
vampire movies and stuff like that. But yeah, I'm looking at the cover right now. And yeah,
00:43:47
you can't really see the it maybe you can't see the herbalists because maybe he's got like armor
00:43:52
on over it. Or maybe that's just what they look like. Like on his chest there. You know, the book
00:43:56
makes it sound like they're literally engulfed his body with the exception of his hands and his face.
00:44:01
Yeah, what you're seeing on the the chest bit there that is the orbalists look at like the
00:44:06
they're like, wookipedia page, they they have that, like that gem thing at the front of their heads.
00:44:14
So there's like four of them on his chest, like all facing inward.
00:44:17
Right. Okay, I got you. So that must be like probably early on in his wearing the orbalists
00:44:23
because yeah, because later on it just it made it sound like except for his head and hands like
00:44:27
they're just everywhere. So they would have been like on his wrists and and on his legs and all
00:44:32
that kind of stuff. It's kind of crazy. So that so that man the thing on his head, that's the mask
00:44:36
that he wears that they don't take over his face, right? So yeah, yeah. And then yeah, you can see
00:44:41
him on his arms. Yep. So that's what I imagined right there. But man, that they also don't look
00:44:47
anything here. Like I envisioned. That's what I thought also looked weird. I didn't envision
00:44:52
them looking like that at all. Yeah, neither did I. What came to mind was the in the mummy,
00:44:58
the little insects in the mummy that explode. Oh, don't remind me of those. Those give me the creepy
00:45:02
crawlies. That's what I imagined them looking like, even though I know they're not that size,
00:45:07
they're way bigger. But I imagine I'm kind of looking like that, but bigger, like just these
00:45:11
black ovals that just that are, you know, that are on the skin like that. So yeah, that's really
00:45:16
interesting. Another thing from the book that I wanted to talk about too, that I thought was
00:45:20
really cool was literally the force my nuke. What was it called? The thought the thought bomb?
00:45:27
Yeah. I want a different type of thought bomb that involves me going out clubbing,
00:45:32
but that thought bomb was also pretty cool. I imagine. Well, I just try to think like,
00:45:37
when could they have ever employed that successfully without people succumbing to it?
00:45:41
Oh, never. Absolutely never. Yeah. That's the red button you don't press. And guess what? It got
00:45:46
pressed. Yeah. So you know why Bane told him to do it, but why would those Sith Lords think they
00:45:52
could do it and nothing would happen? They didn't know what it was. Yeah, they didn't know what it
00:45:57
was. Because he figured that out from like Holocron stuff, right? Or like whatever. Yeah.
00:46:03
Yeah, he passed it on as like a barter, wasn't it? Yeah. He was like, yo, check out this, like,
00:46:08
I killed Kassim. Check out this cool magic stuff that I learned. You should try it on the Jedi.
00:46:14
It'll totally kill them all. Wink, wink. I'm just imagining the note being written exactly like that.
00:46:22
It's just gonna be funny. If it was Lego Star Wars, it would be. Yeah, right. Yeah, totally.
00:46:28
But what I loved most about it was like the like ghost orb that was left at like ground zero and
00:46:35
like the different people who interact with it and can like hear the screams feel like the residual
00:46:40
death. I thought that that was probably one of the most metal scenes I had ever read in Star Wars,
00:46:45
was just the residual death of the ghost orb. Yeah, it's just this like glitch in the matrix
00:46:49
that just hangs out there and it will always be there. That's kind of what you felt, you know,
00:46:54
and so anybody who came near it. So then I would be interested to know like if so if that's employed
00:47:01
at any other time or even if someone were to discover that one on now I forget the planet
00:47:06
they're on but but if they were to discover that one like could anybody interact with it in any
00:47:11
different way that involves the force and what else could be made of or could those souls be
00:47:16
brought back in some way how weird would that be right because they still because when people
00:47:21
interact with it they can still like sense the people that are inside of it the Jedi and the Sith
00:47:26
that succumb to it so it'd be weird if they've somehow could be brought back through through
00:47:31
the force but I bet you could like holocronize them or like put them in a droid but I don't
00:47:37
think you'd be able to recreate or like you could maybe put them in clones like you know palps does
00:47:42
like an essence transfer type of thing yeah you could probably do an essence transfer on them if
00:47:46
you were able to like handle that kind of power for long enough to to pull it off but I don't think
00:47:51
you'd be able to bring them back without something to put them in well I don't think you could yeah
00:47:55
right anything either because if I remember correctly the thought bomb destroys like both
00:48:00
corporeal and non-corporeal aspects of the the the people I think that I thought it destroyed
00:48:06
the corporeal and trapped the non-corporeal I think it destroys both and it just leaves the emotions
00:48:12
that sounds more like the the the leaving the emotion they're leaving the emotions thing sounds
00:48:17
more accurate because you like when everybody's when the when the one guy touches it like he all
00:48:22
he says all he feels is like their anguish and their and uh and their pain like trying to escape
00:48:27
the orb or or within the orb and stuff like that so so yeah wait wait so more than a that okay so
00:48:34
Kyle Katarn uh opened the bomb that one yeah says uh so and I'm looking at wikipedia but it says more
00:48:42
than a thousand years later the spirits of the vanquished jedi were set free so it was a prison
00:48:47
by young rebel agent and jedi knight named Kyle Katarn oh what I saw I did not know that I know
00:48:54
he's a kater I know he's okay but like it's kind of both right because it also says literally when
00:49:01
detonated a thought bomb annihilated the entirety corporeal and non-corporeal of every force sensitive
00:49:08
being caught within its blast radius but then it also says and absorbed their fragmented souls into
00:49:14
a swirling vortex of perpetual torment so it's both I guess it is so I guess so fuck us both
00:49:21
yeah I just I just uh I just googled it like to to see if like the Kyle Katarn opening it up and
00:49:30
they it says like in the events that take place in the dark forces series of uh novellas they only
00:49:36
seem to refer to the force nexus that was created as a later result of the weapons use so they are
00:49:40
talking about the orb that's left there so damn it's just that orb just sat there for a thousand
00:49:46
years huh I think you were led to believe that that's what it would do like it would just sit
00:49:49
there until I mean until whatever I don't know what could happen to make it disappear like it
00:49:54
wouldn't it wouldn't wither away or anything like that um I guess I had just assumed that maybe some
00:50:02
some sith along the line in the rule of two had come back because Zana knew about it so I assumed
00:50:08
that Zana probably told Cogniz something about it and then maybe like somewhere down the line
00:50:12
someone was like oh hey there's a thought bomb prison on this planet what was it Rusan there's
00:50:17
a spoke to the picture of it oh there's a picture of it yeah it's an egg it's a thought egg that's
00:50:22
what I imagined it looking like is is the is like a yeah like a silvery egg sitting in the
00:50:27
middle of the cave um that's so creepy it's got a little sperm flying around it too right that's
00:50:31
kind of what it looks like I know that's crazy right oh Rusan yeah they're on Rusan that's what
00:50:36
it was okay Kyle Katarn one of my students unfolded the thought bomb's vortex at Rusan and freed the
00:50:42
spirits that had been trapped inside for more than a thousand years that was Luke said that
00:50:47
um so this is corrupted by a note written by Luke in book of oh that was in the book of sith I have
00:50:51
the I have the Jedi one the Jedi path I have that one but I don't have the book of sith I don't have
00:50:56
I also have the Jedi path and not the book of sith huh the more you've learned so much today so then
00:51:02
if he released them to Wenchi's point where did he release them to so in the game's alternate the
00:51:09
non-canon dark side storyline he absorbs the power and assumes the throne of galactic emperor
00:51:16
Katarn does yes what I've never heard his name said as Katarn before so I say it yeah no it's
00:51:23
okay like okay so one thing that I am I'm universally okay with is people saying Star
00:51:28
Wars names wrong because everyone calls it their own thing and there's no like guy to be like this
00:51:32
is how you pronounce this thing this is how you pronounce this name you know so I I never judge
00:51:36
anyone for how they seen it I've just never heard it said Katarn before until you'd said until I
00:51:41
heard you say Revan I always said Revan I always said Revan and then you and then I heard you say
00:51:45
it and then someone else told me that it that's how it was said well where do they officially
00:51:50
pronounce it well I don't remember if they I think don't they say Revan and Kotor exotic
00:51:56
yeah see that's where I would that's where I wouldn't have heard it then because I didn't
00:51:59
play the games yeah but for some of these other characters wait what they I guess they say they
00:52:03
say Kyle's in the game too though yeah they say yeah but you've never played the game so you
00:52:07
wouldn't know that's I'm not judging you I promise because I know I be saying some fucking names
00:52:11
wrong so Jedi Knight and Jedi Knight 2 I played but did they say Katarn in that in those games
00:52:18
because it's been so long since I even played them see I haven't played those I could tell you
00:52:21
yeah I know they say it in outcasts and I know they say it in Jedi Knights Academy okay all right
00:52:27
it's been a while for those games too but though so if you if you played Jedi Knight 2 that that
00:52:34
was yeah that was Jedi Outcast wasn't it Dark Forces Jedi Knight yeah the first Jedi Knight
00:52:38
Dark Force Jedi Knight like Kyle Katarn's character does not feel like it would assume any kind of
00:52:45
role as a Galactic Emperor he is such a like Han Solo scoundrel type character in that game like
00:52:53
and obviously people can evolve like you know Luke evolved from a whiny little kid on a on a
00:52:59
moisture farm whiny little bitch I know you want to say yeah I was about to say you can say it
00:53:03
whiny little bitch on a on a moisture farm to uh to like a serious like Jedi Knight in episode six
00:53:09
so it could happen but I just it just sounds weird that sounds weird to me envisioning him that way
00:53:15
but um wow we learned a lot today yeah we did yeah but it like we we started off with like
00:53:22
uh greatest of all time you know so I think he I think he did have the greatest potential of all
00:53:27
time I will say that um because he because he was driven enough and and naturally strong enough
00:53:33
with the Dark Side of the Force and and just the fact that he was driven enough with all the stuff
00:53:38
that he learned and all he was he wanted to go to any place he could go to to learn as much as
00:53:44
possible about uh the Dark Side and Sith legends and everything that had come before him so that
00:53:48
he could just be an all-encompassing knowledge of the Dark Side and be as strong and and uh and
00:53:55
knowledgeable as possible so I think he had definitely the best potential of all time now
00:53:59
you know we already touched on Sidious being an uh a student of the Dark Side too so but he's more
00:54:03
of a politician so in terms of like strength I give it to Bane like over Palpatine well in terms
00:54:10
of potential um but but Palpatine's like manipulative abilities and and in in his
00:54:17
in his knowledge like that put together definitely has an edge over Bane but I think Bane had the
00:54:23
potential to be stronger than Palpatine yeah but we'll never know because he only he only
00:54:29
that's mastered the Dark Side for 25 years I've never I've never thought of it like I never
00:54:33
thought about Bane's potential like the only potential of a person I've ever thought about
00:54:36
was Anakin Skywalker because you know like the Chosen One but I've never actually thought about
00:54:41
Bane's potential and you know what you are right because like for such a short amount of time and
00:54:46
like he wasn't even trained from like birth and he he grew so strong so fast so you know what I
00:54:52
might actually have to give that one to you like I think you might be right the only thing he really
00:54:56
had to do in the first book was master his own demons like like his own like his shortcoming
00:55:02
with like his insecurities you know about um like his abuse from his father and stuff like that he
00:55:07
just felt like he he thought he had what it took but then he didn't know how to fully connect and
00:55:11
then once he figured it out it was just this it was like the strongest connection like that's how
00:55:15
they described it like he is just this like overwhelming like he could draw upon it at any
00:55:20
time at that point so yeah I thought that's all I could think about after the third book to be
00:55:24
honest with you was like man what else could he have done if he survived this and and what else
00:55:29
could he have done if he never discovered the orbalists or at least uh took on the orbalists
00:55:34
if that never happened like his body would have disfigured they aged him so much by the mid-40s
00:55:39
that he's basically like mid-60s because of what they did to him you know so and but he was still
00:55:45
like like then you if you look at uh the beginning of the book uh dynasty of evil like they say he
00:55:51
went out into the rain and then he's like lightsaber practicing and he can fend off every rain droplet
00:55:57
and not get wet in the rain for like what was it like a half an hour he was wielding the lightsaber
00:56:02
to to fend off every rain droplet like come on man that's like that's some really op type
00:56:07
shit right there so then so when I read that and then realized man if he didn't have orbalists this
00:56:13
guy would have been crazy strong and if he survived zana and you know obviously he picked a good
00:56:19
apprentice because zana was also extremely strong manipulative knowledgeable and could use her
00:56:26
talents like to the to the highest potential that she could you know so oh you know what I'm glad
00:56:31
you mentioned zana because one thing that I do want to talk about before we we close out this
00:56:34
episode is how fucked up some of his training for zana was like I forget what the name of the
00:56:40
fucking creature was but she like befriended it for a month and he was like yeah go fucking kill it
00:56:44
I was like for real and then she had to murder her like best friend in the in the book yeah I think
00:56:50
it was in yeah she had so part of her training was she had to prevent so she had to go find an animal
00:56:56
and and lure it in and then kill it and then she had to go find the same animal like and be
00:57:00
friended for like a month and then kill it oh yeah I do remember that I don't remember the animal
00:57:06
but that story sounds familiar because those those were in flashbacks in the second book right yeah
00:57:11
I think it was the second book yeah yeah those would have been flashbacks because I don't think
00:57:15
they actually in real time talk about like no but it was so fucked up like imagine getting a puppy
00:57:20
getting so close to this puppy and then your dad's like okay take it out to the backyard here's my
00:57:24
shotgun here's another mind fuck like how different is that from the jedi saying we like you can't have
00:57:31
any attachments like like he's he's basically telling her like okay you know for for your own
00:57:37
personal like uh as a tool use this animal to what you need it to do and then get rid of it not
00:57:44
saying the jedi would do the same thing but he's basically telling her like you can't be attached
00:57:48
to anything you have to use what you need to use to get what you need and then it's it's gone you
00:57:54
know so I think it's fucked up regardless of what kind of glasses you look at it through but I'm
00:58:00
gonna go with the sith the sith the sith take the cake on this one the sith get that done that was
00:58:04
really fucked up yeah yeah it's definitely the kingsman experience yes yeah fuck oh don't remind
00:58:12
me of the kingsman either uh-huh hey at least xe walked out with that dog I was so proud of him
00:58:20
yeah but but then the never mind that yeah then the second move yeah okay yeah
00:58:25
yeah fuck
00:58:29
all right well uh that has been today's episode I know it was supposed to be mostly focused on
00:58:33
bane but we kind of derailed that train real early and kept derailing it but it was it was
00:58:38
it was fun it was a great conversation rampage you were an absolutely amazing first guest for our
00:58:43
show and I couldn't have think of another best first guest that we could have had thank you so
00:58:47
much for being on the show would you like to tell our fans where they can find you and your content
00:58:52
yeah for sure thanks man and I really appreciate being here thanks for having me on and you guys
00:58:56
are awesome to talk to and and you guys obviously have way more uh legends knowledge than I've been
00:59:02
able to acquire but like I want to get to the end and and then just like I want to get all the
00:59:08
knowledge just like bane you know and just and be able to wield it all so you guys anybody can find
00:59:13
me on twitter at rampage tweets and it's um at rampage t w e e t z not s so and then uh and you
00:59:21
can find me on youtube rampage reviews I don't know if it's I don't know if the tag is uh youtube.com
00:59:26
slash rampage reviews I think there's like some string of numbers but if you search for rampage
00:59:31
reviews you should be able to find me and I've got some weird first videos because that was like
00:59:36
my phase of not wanting to spoil the books but then after like when I started coming back and
00:59:41
doing it because that was like three years ago me doing it and lately when I've been doing it I just
00:59:46
said fuck it I'm just going to talk about the book I don't care if I spoil it you know like I just
00:59:49
want to talk about it so um so if you do watch the videos just be prepared they're they're spoiled
00:59:55
but I do have my upcoming reads in the description on the video so that my next three books I always
01:00:02
have listed in the description in case people want to get into it before they watch my videos so we
01:00:07
can start that conversation so yeah. All right guys well we will be sure to include a link to his
01:00:13
twitter and to his youtube in the channel description so be sure to check it out to make
01:00:16
sure you can follow him for some really awesome book reviews and some pretty cool Diablo gameplay
01:00:20
honestly I've that's what I'd be watching when you talk it's really awesome to see the the
01:00:25
playthroughs that he includes with his reviews but yeah make sure you give him a follow he's been
01:00:30
he's been absolutely interacting with uh you know this guy on twitter and just you know getting to
01:00:35
finally talk to him on our podcast has been an absolute blast if I mentioned it but that is our
01:00:39
show for today everyone be sure to tune in on Tuesdays for our regular released force facts
01:00:46
where you can get your weekly force fact from us here at the force unscripted so make sure you are
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01:01:04
podcast it's just simply the force unscripted but until next time peace out girl scouts may the force
01:01:09
be with you and we will catch you on the next one